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Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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I would just put them all in RAID 0. I am/was looking for a high performance solution that would give me a total of 200+ GB for my OS/Game drive. I'll be purchasing additional drives for storage (or just use my media server that has 4+TB).

Post Mon Mar 29, 2010 9:50 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Nikola wrote: Well, the main gain of the 160gb over dual 80gb is that you keep TRIM support since it doesn't work in RAID.

As for bang for the buck, that depends on what you want. There are a plethora of drives that have ~30mb/s slower reads but have about 60mb/s faster writes and I believe on average they are cheaper than the X25-M. Look at the OCZ Vertex series for the best deal I think.


I think I got ahead of myself. I believe the drives that were reviewed for the test on Tom's Hardware were from the 1st Gen X-25 M drives. It appears that the 2nd Gen drives are outstanding, but there are some faster drives out there, such as OCZ's Vertex 2 Pro (dont believe its released yet).

I'm going to do a bit more digging, but if I cant find something that shatters the X-25 M (160GB) scores for around the same price, them I'm going to call it a day and get them.

I'm going from a stand alone Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 drive to this new setup, so Im sure I'll be happy with just about any performance based SSD. I just happen to get wrapped up in all the details on my build, especially when Im dropping cash like this....

Post Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:19 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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I think I stand corrected. I think the drive was released but not as the OCZ Vertex 2 Pro, but as the "OCZ Vertex Limited Edition"..... Anyone else know about this?



http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227508

Post Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:29 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Nikola
Hung Like a Flea


Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Posts: 790
Location: Edmond, OK
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The Limited Edition is certainly faster, all the reviews I read on it said wonderful things. You would not go wrong with it at all. But 4 80gb Gen2 X25-M drives will smoke a pair of those OCZ Limiteds.
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Post Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:44 am  View user's profile Send private message AIM Address ICQ Number
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Nikola wrote: The Limited Edition is certainly faster, all the reviews I read on it said wonderful things. You would not go wrong with it at all. But 4 80gb Gen2 X25-M drives will smoke a pair of those OCZ Limiteds.


Wouldnt I hit the limits of the SATA 3Gbps spec before I hit the limit of the of the 4x Intel drives?

I'm not against the 4x Intel drives, I just have reservations with using so many drives in RAID 0. It only takes one to fail and then Im back to reinstalling everything.

I guess I'll think about this a little more, but this is the last thing I need to work out before I get my new rig ordered. Hopefully I'll have everything good to go for the next LAN.

Post Tue Mar 30, 2010 9:12 am  View user's profile Send private message
Nikola
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Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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The SATA 3gb/s spec is per channel, so no. The other thing to mention is that from the speed drive you're coming from, a single X25-M would blow your mind by comparison so I don't think you need to sweat it so much.
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Post Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:11 pm  View user's profile Send private message AIM Address ICQ Number
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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Well this is what I did up until a few years ago. Since I started doing enterprise level networking I have been getting rusty on my hardware knowledge. So when Im specing out systems I tend to fall back into my old habits. I use to spend retarded amounts of time researching/reviewing/testing, but I'm off my A game now.

Post Tue Mar 30, 2010 6:49 pm  View user's profile Send private message
VinceVaughn
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Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 630
Location: OKC
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it happens to us all man....
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Post Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:25 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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Alright I finally made up my mind, Im going with the 2x Intel X-25 M 160GBs.

I didnt want to lose out on the extra 120GB of space compared to the OCZs and with this being a micro build, I didnt want to use up the majority of my drive bays with SSDs.

I haven't gotten a "check is on the way" message from UPS, but when I called and checked on it, it sounded promising, so Im ordering it tonight. Dont want to miss out on the next LAN because my rig is still busted!

Post Thu Apr 01, 2010 5:11 pm  View user's profile Send private message
LightningCrash
Smile like Bob, order your free LC today


Joined: 03 Apr 2003
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I was thinking about doing a RAID10 with two SSDs and 1 hard drive.

RAID1 has 2 disk members:
Disk 1: A RAID0 array with the two SSDs
Disk 2: 7200rpm SATA disk just a tad bigger than Disk 1.

With read and write biasing given to Disk 1 in the kernel.

I'll have to try that out sometime in a VM and see how it does Wink

Post Thu Apr 01, 2010 7:37 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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LightningCrash wrote: I was thinking about doing a RAID10 with two SSDs and 1 hard drive.

RAID1 has 2 disk members:
Disk 1: A RAID0 array with the two SSDs
Disk 2: 7200rpm SATA disk just a tad bigger than Disk 1.

With read and write biasing given to Disk 1 in the kernel.

I'll have to try that out sometime in a VM and see how it does Wink


Id be interested to see how that turns out.

Post Thu Apr 01, 2010 7:46 pm  View user's profile Send private message
singe
You Know You Want Some


Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 27
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Currently I have the retail x25-m 80G. It's set up for boot, swap, and normal installed software. And... a few select games. (supcom2 will be on there when I decide to buy)

Be sure you get a newer 34nm x25-m . The older 50nm ones (like the one found in the cheap dynamax kit) DO NOT and CAN NOT support trim. Not even with a firmware update.

I've got a pair of WD 160s in software raid0. I install games and other things I can loose there.

Then a single 1tb for stuff I actually want to keep. That gets exported via esata to a backup drive.

Font color: You might check and see... but I am fairly certian if you go software stripe, you can keep your trim support. But... windows can't boot to a software raided volume...

Also, I've been told that the only good raid is hardware raid. I dissagree. raid 0 or 1 requires no parity calculation. Almost zero impact. Raid5... that's where people get the idea for dedicated raid controlers. Even if you go raid5 now via software, for desktop apps the xor calcs done by the cpu are silly to worry about. If I had a single core atom, I would be worried. I wouldn't think about it with a quad though. A few of the better reasons for a good hardware raid controler is a fat cache (which may be questionable now that microsoft finally started caching IO in ram), if you have unnaturally heavy IO, irrespective of bandwith (Think oltp database), if you get extras like a blinkie light when a drive failure, or if you need to present a single physical drive to boot your os from (windows).

well that was a bit of a detour slash

anyways, I am very happy with the setup I have now, but when I do my upgrade, I think I am going to go for raid0 on 4 drives.


And about putting more drives in stripe - drive failure is not actually dependent on the number of drives in a raid0 setup. Just because you stripe a bunch of drives doesn't make any of them more likely to fail than a single drive. Having a raid0 array with 8 drives is not 8 times mroe likely to fail. In fact, I would argue that the drives might last LONGER because IO is spread across them, leading to less use. The scarry is how much data you have on those 8 drives. If they are small, you could easily loose as much data as you would on a big fat media drive.

Post Thu Apr 01, 2010 8:11 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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I verified that the model numbers were that of the G2's (34nm) for the Intel drive, but good looking out. I'd hate to have gotten them to find out they were G1's.

Lots of good info singe, but what Im talking about with the failing drives is the fact that when you rely on all your drives to work you are increasing you failure rate exponentially for each drive you add.

For example, if I have 4 drives in RAID 0 and the failure rate on the drives is 2%. My failure rate for my RAID array isnt 2% its actually 16% (2*2*2*2), because I am relying on all the drives to function for my container to continue to work. I don't know the real failure rates for these drives, as I could only find the MTBF which was 1,500,000 hours, but that should give you an idea what I was talking about.

Post Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:23 am  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Oh I forgot to mention, I ordered everything (aside of the video card) last night and I should be getting everything at the beginning of next week, pending UPS not breaking shit again.

Post Fri Apr 02, 2010 11:24 am  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Some of my parts started rolling in yesterday, and I'll be able to build the machine (minus the case) today (RAM is getting delivered today).

I wasn't overly impressed with Newegg's packaging for the one OEM SSD that I got. It was shipped in a bubble envelope and only had minimal padding in the small box it was in, but the one that was the retail version was packaged very well. The retail one's were on sale, but I could only order one... so I had to get one OEM and one retail. You would think they might package a $400 drive slightly better...


This is what showed up so far, Ill get pics when I get the memory today:
ASUS Rampage II GENE X58 mATX
Intel Core i7-960 Bloomfield 3.2GHz Intel Core i7-930 Bloomfield 2.8GHz
2x Intel X25-M Mainstream 160GB SSDs
Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 1TB
Pioneer Blu-ray Writer BDR-205BKS
Rosewill RX-C200 2.5” SSD / HDD Aluminum Mounting Kit for 3.5" Drive Bay
nMEDIAPC ZE-C128 Black Aluminum Panel (Upfront USB/Audio/Card Reader)


Oh ya, and UPS finally paid me!


Does anyone know a place around here to get some decent airbrush work done? It wont be anything complicated, but I'm looking to get some custom paint on the new case.

Post Wed Apr 07, 2010 9:45 am  View user's profile Send private message
Nikola
Hung Like a Flea


Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Posts: 790
Location: Edmond, OK
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You got a 960 and a 930 o.O?
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Post Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:42 am  View user's profile Send private message AIM Address ICQ Number
TehDanMan
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Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 13143
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I get a new micro build every 5 - 10 minutes. Sometimes it interferes with work.
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Post Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:46 am  View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Petch
n00b


Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Nikola wrote: You got a 960 and a 930 o.O?



My bad on that one, I got the 930.

Post Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:52 am  View user's profile Send private message
LightningCrash
Smile like Bob, order your free LC today


Joined: 03 Apr 2003
Posts: 5020
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Petch wrote:
LightningCrash wrote: I was thinking about doing a RAID10 with two SSDs and 1 hard drive.

RAID1 has 2 disk members:
Disk 1: A RAID0 array with the two SSDs
Disk 2: 7200rpm SATA disk just a tad bigger than Disk 1.

With read and write biasing given to Disk 1 in the kernel.

I'll have to try that out sometime in a VM and see how it does Wink


Id be interested to see how that turns out.


I tried it out in a VM, using loopback disks in /dev/shm and some real disk
You set the real disk up as --write-mostly, set up a write-intent bitmap on the SSDs and enable write-behind (which will enable write-behind only for the --write-mostly disks)
In this configuration the writes are as fast as the SSD until you hit the limit of the write-intent bitmap (however big you configured that to be in write-behind x stripe size)
Reads are almost always SSD speed because of the --write-mostly on the HDD.

Really a pretty smoking setup, it would go great with the appropriate SSDs and HDDs.

Read some blog posts on this very thing, I'll see if I can find them.

Post Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:11 pm  View user's profile Send private message
Petch
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Joined: 11 Mar 2010
Posts: 57
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Well I found out that both of my ATI 4850's are no good... so it looks like Ill be rocking either 2x Nvidia 8800 GTS OC2s (320MB) or just a single card, depending on heat. Ill be using them until I can find an XFX 5970 card in stock somewhere.

The machine is built and running, gave it a test spin last night but with no overclocking Im already seeing 74C on my NB and 64C on my SB, but the worst the CPU got last night was 39C. I think Im going to have to pull one of the 8800GTS's out and seeing if I can get another fan in there just for the NB.

Post Fri Apr 09, 2010 12:34 pm  View user's profile Send private message
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